Who are we…?

We are a group of clergy who are concerned about the direction of the United Church of Canada in its recent decision to bring designated lay ministers (DLMs) into the Order of Ministry regardless of the Remit 6 from GC42…

We’ve articulated a response to Rev.Dr. Janzen-Ball’s letter…

Add your name to our list of supporters!

Now it’s up to you…

Rev. Phyllis Dietrich, B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dianne Everitt, B.A., B.Ed., M.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Deb Foster, B.A. (Hons.), M.Div., ThM, D.Min (Candidate), (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. Barbara Fullerton, B.Sc., MTS, STM, DMIN (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. Sheila Macgregor, B.A. (Hons), M.A., M.Div. D.Min., PhD (c.) (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. John Mathew, B.A., M.A., M.Div., M.Th. Th.D. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. I. Anne McGrath, B.A., MDiv. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Glenn Brown, B.F.S., M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. Scott Boughner, M. Div., D. Min. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Susan McIlveen, M.Div., (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Donald D. McKay, B.A., M. Div., C.P.E. (Ordained Minister) ,

Rev. Alison Miculan, B.A. (Hons.), M.A., M. Div., Ph.D. (abd), (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Micheline Montreuil B.Th. Dip. CCS (Diaconal Minister),

Rev. James Murray, B.B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. Christopher Levan, B.A., M.A., M. Div., Ph.D. (Ordained Minister) ,

Rev. Amadeus Pyralis, M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Dr. Barry Rieder, (Designated Lay Minister),

Rev. Dr. Robert Thompson, B.A., M.Div., STM, D. Min. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. Mark Toulouse, B.A., M.Div., Ph.D. (Ordained Minister and Past Principal, Professor Emeritus, Emmanuel College),

Rev. Phyllis Dietrich, B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dianne Everitt, B.A., B.Ed., M.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Deb Foster, B.A. (Hons.), M.Div., ThM, D.Min (Candidate), (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. Barbara Fullerton, B.Sc., MTS, STM, DMIN (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. Sheila Macgregor, B.A. (Hons), M.A., M.Div. D.Min., PhD (c.) (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. John Mathew, B.A., M.A., M.Div., M.Th. Th.D. (Ordained Minister), Rev. I. Anne McGrath, B.A., MDiv. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Glenn Brown, B.F.S., M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. Scott Boughner, M. Div., D. Min. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Susan McIlveen, M.Div., (Ordained Minister), Rev. Donald D. McKay, B.A., M. Div., C.P.E. (Ordained Minister) , Rev. Alison Miculan, B.A. (Hons.), M.A., M. Div., Ph.D. (abd), (Ordained Minister), Rev. Micheline Montreuil B.Th. Dip. CCS (Diaconal Minister), Rev. James Murray, B.B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. Christopher Levan, B.A., M.A., M. Div., Ph.D. (Ordained Minister) , Rev. Amadeus Pyralis, M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Dr. Barry Rieder, (Designated Lay Minister), Rev. Dr. Robert Thompson, B.A., M.Div., STM, D. Min. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. Mark Toulouse, B.A., M.Div., Ph.D. (Ordained Minister and Past Principal, Professor Emeritus, Emmanuel College),

Rev. Marilyn Townsend-Smith, B.A., M. Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. Diane Walker, B.A., M.Div., D.Min. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. S. Peter Wyatt, B.A., M.Div., Th.D. (Ordained Minister and Past Principal and Associate Professor Emeritus, Emmanuel College),

Rev. Karl Jung Hyun Shin, B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Janet Kennedy, B.Th. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. Greg Brawn, B.A., M.Div., D. Min. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. Paul Rodey, B.A.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Murray Rounding, B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Thomas Dunbar, B.Sc.(Hons), M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. David Zub, B.A., M.Div., Th. D. (Ordained Minister)

Rev. Kim Gilliland, B.Comm., M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Lorraine Diaz, B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Cathy Russell Duggan, B.A., M. Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Susan Chisholm, B.Mus., B.Ed., M.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Lisa M. Greenwood, B.A., MDiv, C.D. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Norine Pitre, (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Merle Lynn Watson, B.Th., M.T.S. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Keith Hagerman, B.A., B.Mus., M.Div., M.S.M. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Felicia Urbanski, B.M., M.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Sally Ann Longfellow, B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

The Session of Faith Centennial United Church, Selkirk, ON. ,

Rev. Jope Langejans, B.A., B.Th., M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Ryan Fea, M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. George Moore, B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Daniel Benson, B.A., CMW, M.T.S. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Louise Mahood, B.A., M.Div., M.P.S. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Greg Daly, B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Andrew Gilliland, (CA), M.Div., (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Jim Postlethwaith, B.A., M. Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Mark Rutledge, B.Mus., A.R.C.T., M.Div., M.Th. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Young-Hwan “Bright” Yun, B.Th., M. Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. Gordon Crossfield, B.A., B.D., D. Min. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. Paul Wilson, B.Sc., M.Div., Ph.D., AB, Professor Emeritus of Homiletics, Emmanuel College, University of Toronto (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Deanna Wilson, B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. Philip Gardner, B.A., M.A., M. Div. Ph. D. (Ordained Minister) ,

Rev. Dr. John James, B.A., M.Div., D. Min. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Joshua Kang, B.A,, M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. Paul Currie, B.A., M. Div. D. Min. (Ordained Minister) ,

Rev. Beverly Thompson, B.A., M. Div., Th.M. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Randy Banks, B.A., M. Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Marilyn Townsend-Smith, B.A., M. Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. Diane Walker, B.A., M.Div., D.Min. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. S. Peter Wyatt, B.A., M.Div., Th.D. (Ordained Minister and Past Principal and Associate Professor Emeritus, Emmanuel College), Rev. Karl Jung Hyun Shin, B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Janet Kennedy, B.Th. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. Greg Brawn, B.A., M.Div., D. Min. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. Paul Rodey, B.A.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Murray Rounding, B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Thomas Dunbar, B.Sc.(Hons), M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. David Zub, B.A., M.Div., Th. D. (Ordained Minister) Rev. Kim Gilliland, B.Comm., M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Lorraine Diaz, B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Cathy Russell Duggan, B.A., M. Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Susan Chisholm, B.Mus., B.Ed., M.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Lisa M. Greenwood, B.A., MDiv, C.D. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Norine Pitre, (Ordained Minister), Rev. Merle Lynn Watson, B.Th., M.T.S. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Keith Hagerman, B.A., B.Mus., M.Div., M.S.M. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Felicia Urbanski, B.M., M.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Sally Ann Longfellow, B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister), The Session of Faith Centennial United Church, Selkirk, ON. , Rev. Jope Langejans, B.A., B.Th., M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Ryan Fea, M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. George Moore, B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Daniel Benson, B.A., CMW, M.T.S. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Louise Mahood, B.A., M.Div., M.P.S. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Greg Daly, B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Andrew Gilliland, (CA), M.Div., (Ordained Minister), Rev. Jim Postlethwaith, B.A., M. Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Mark Rutledge, B.Mus., A.R.C.T., M.Div., M.Th. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Young-Hwan “Bright” Yun, B.Th., M. Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. Gordon Crossfield, B.A., B.D., D. Min. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. Paul Wilson, B.Sc., M.Div., Ph.D., AB, Professor Emeritus of Homiletics, Emmanuel College, University of Toronto (Ordained Minister), Rev. Deanna Wilson, B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. Philip Gardner, B.A., M.A., M. Div. Ph. D. (Ordained Minister) , Rev. Dr. John James, B.A., M.Div., D. Min. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Joshua Kang, B.A,, M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. Paul Currie, B.A., M. Div. D. Min. (Ordained Minister) , Rev. Beverly Thompson, B.A., M. Div., Th.M. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Randy Banks, B.A., M. Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Randall C. MacKenzie, B.A., M.Div., (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Meriel Simpson, B.A., M. Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. A. H. Harry Oussoren, M.A., M. Div., Ph.D. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. Catherine Collins-Barker B.A.(Hons.), M.Div., D.Min. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. Paul Miller, B.A., M.Div,, Ph.D. (Ordained Minister),

Mr. Dayle K. Barrett, BTEC First, M.Div. (near completion), (Candidate for Ordained Ministry),

Rev. Barbara Zimmerman, B.A., M.Div., (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. William Kervin, B.Sc., M. Div., Th.D. Associate Professor Emeritus of Public Worship, Emmanuel College, University of Toronto (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. Orville James, B.Sc., M. Div., D. Min. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. Ross Bartlett, M.A., M. Div., D. Th., D. Min. United Church Formation Director, Adjunct Professor, Atlantic School of Theology (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. Cheryl Wood-Thomas, B.A., M. Div., D. Min. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. Cheri DiNovo, CM (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Susan Peverly, B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. Michael Wilson, B.Sc., M.Div., D. Min. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Dr. Gordon Taylor, B.A., M. Div., D. Min (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Nancy Finlayson, B. Ed., M. Div. Cert. Spiritual Direction (Ordained Minister),

Rev. William Thomas, B.A., M.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Wendy Bily, B.Sc.N., M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Ryan Slifka, (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Lois Gaudet, BBA, B.Th., M. Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Jessica McCrae, B.A (Hons), M. Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Cynthia R. Stretton B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister),

Rev Sheila Murray, B.A (Hons), MRE, M. Div. (Ordained Minister, Retired),

Rev. Nancy Knowles, BA, MDiv, MST, (Ordained Minister),

Rev. Patrick Woodbeck (Ordained Mnister),

Rev. Dr. Stephen B. Iverson B.A(Hons), M.Div, D. Min (Ordained Minister)

Rev. Randall C. MacKenzie, B.A., M.Div., (Ordained Minister), Rev. Meriel Simpson, B.A., M. Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. A. H. Harry Oussoren, M.A., M. Div., Ph.D. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. Catherine Collins-Barker B.A.(Hons.), M.Div., D.Min. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. Paul Miller, B.A., M.Div,, Ph.D. (Ordained Minister), Mr. Dayle K. Barrett, BTEC First, M.Div. (near completion), (Candidate for Ordained Ministry), Rev. Barbara Zimmerman, B.A., M.Div., (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. William Kervin, B.Sc., M. Div., Th.D. Associate Professor Emeritus of Public Worship, Emmanuel College, University of Toronto (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. Orville James, B.Sc., M. Div., D. Min. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. Ross Bartlett, M.A., M. Div., D. Th., D. Min. United Church Formation Director, Adjunct Professor, Atlantic School of Theology (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. Cheryl Wood-Thomas, B.A., M. Div., D. Min. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. Cheri DiNovo, CM (Ordained Minister), Rev. Susan Peverly, B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. Michael Wilson, B.Sc., M.Div., D. Min. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Dr. Gordon Taylor, B.A., M. Div., D. Min (Ordained Minister), Rev. Nancy Finlayson, B. Ed., M. Div. Cert. Spiritual Direction (Ordained Minister), Rev. William Thomas, B.A., M.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Wendy Bily, B.Sc.N., M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Ryan Slifka, (Ordained Minister), Rev. Lois Gaudet, BBA, B.Th., M. Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Jessica McCrae, B.A (Hons), M. Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev. Cynthia R. Stretton B.A., M.Div. (Ordained Minister), Rev Sheila Murray, B.A (Hons), MRE, M. Div. (Ordained Minister, Retired), Rev. Nancy Knowles, BA, MDiv, MST, (Ordained Minister), Rev. Patrick Woodbeck (Ordained Mnister), Rev. Dr. Stephen B. Iverson B.A(Hons), M.Div, D. Min (Ordained Minister)

Our list of supporters continues to grow!

  • For someone who has gone through yearly appointments for 29 years as a staff associate, designated minister and then a recognized Designated Lay Minister I believe in the truest sense I have been called to a particular ministry (i.e., Community). I think we have made a grave mistake in thinking that Ordained and Commissioned are the only reasons to confirm a call. In trying to fix it we have only made things worse.

    Dr. Barry Rieder, Jane Finch Community Minister, DLM

  • The denominational drift to a “much less” educated clergy is not a United Church of Canada-only problem. It’s pretty much across the board in the old mainline. A lack of respect for education, for university education especially, is a cultural problem.

    Rev. Dr. Mark G. Toulouse, B.A., M.Div., Ph.D. (Past Principal, Emmanuel College, Professor Emeritus, Emmanuel College, U. of T.)

  • I certainly hope that what I bring to my ministry is distinguishable from what DLMs bring. This is not to deny their passion, their call, their commitment or their faith, but that my knowledge and experience through academic learning affects how I, and how anyone, lives and sees the world, understands relationships, and works in pastoral ministry. Please do not assume that an academic history is absent of other preparation and training that was, and as I've experienced, required for the complexities of pastoral ministry today. Beyond this, there was true wisdom in the earlier years that established the parameters by which my call was tested, and that showed me the path to best prepare me to serve as an Ordained Minister.

    Rev. Deb Foster, HBA, MDiv, ThM, DMin (candidate)

  • It is possible to distinguish between the content of the failed remit and that of the GC proposal. The GC proposal calls for the admission of individual DLMs to the existing order of ministry while the defeated remit called for the admission of all DLMs as a new stream in the order of ministry. But the distinction starts to blur when the practical outcome of each is considered. In both cases, the goal is that DLMs would become ordered ministers. They would receive the testamur through a church committee examining their portfolio of study rather than through a program of education and training characterized by study in arm’s-length institutions of learning. A phrase in the proposal is telling. The learning standard for DLMs is “to demonstrate that they meet the requirements for Testamur and readiness for commissioning or ordination.” The latter phrase indicates that the goal of the proposal is to achieve what the failed remit did not – recognition of DLMs as candidates for the same kind of ministry as exercised by ordained and commissioned ministers. In consideration of the goal of the proposal, it does seem that the proposal is a way to achieve the goal of the remit for DLMs on an individual rather than a group basis. The United Church has a covenant with those whom it ordains, commissions, and recognizes. Would it not be wise and just for the church to keep faithful to the terms of these covenants?

    Rev. Dr. S. Peter Wyatt, B.A., M. Div. Th.D., (Past Principal and Associate Professor Emeritus,

    Emmanuel College, U. of T.)

  • The decision regarding DLMs is quite troubling on two fronts: (1) it flies in the face of the clear resolve of the church expressed through remit; and (2) it appears to unilaterally redefine the historic meaning of testamur which has always referred to learning, by now adding the possibility of substituting length of service as qualification. The concerns for DLMs which this policy-change are intended to address could have been accomplished in more effective fashion. I urge my colleagues on the Judicial Committee to consider the appeal that has been launched.

    Rev. Dr. Ross Bartlett, United Church Formation Director, Atlantic School of Theology

  • This looks like a disrespectful attempt to by-pass the clear intent of the One Order of Ministry decision.  There is also an unseemly haste about this:  decision in October, interviews in first quarter, Ordinations and Commissionings delivered before summer?   This is a marked and therefore suspicious departure from the United Church’s normal (glacial) speed of decision making.  Through the E and S and now OV processes, I have noted the enormous sacrifices individuals make to meet the requirements for Ordination, Commissioning, Admission, and Designation, sacrifices which are financial, familial, personal.  [...]  And now, in theory, someone with a high school education, working half time as a church school co-ordinator, having upgraded from Staff Associate to DLM without doing a single academic course, or working under educational supervision, or going through discernment, or the attendant battery of interviews, can once again, move category simply by asking to be Ordained or Commissioned.  This seems like a radical devaluation of academic coursework, the discernment process, ministry formation through supervised education and the extensive interview process.

    Rev. Dr. Diane Walker, Ordained Minister